12/30/2012 2:42:21 AM
Greg Dent
Administrator
Posts: 195
|
Ok, nobody's actually asked us yet, but I'm sure someone is thinking it (or will ask us), so I figure I'd best explain this one up front. Why are we moving towards our own game system?
Good question. There are actually many reasons, but chiefly is that OSRS is what we use when we play RPGs. Why do we use it? Well, we started out playing other systems and generally found them to have problems, or things we didn't like. So we started changing the rules. Eventually the rules changed enough that it was its own system. And at this point, we actually are pretty happy with what we came up with.
All of the key elements of the OSRS came out of things we found lacking in other systems (active defense, hit locations, classless character advancement, critical hits, stamina vs. wound pools, a functional magic system, armor as damage reduction, etc.) You can see the roots of the OSRS as far back as the Arms and Armor book I wrote for Bastion Press about ten years ago. So basically, OSRS is actually the system that we are familiar with, comfortable with, and love.
Next comes the business reasons. We jumped on the Pathfinder bandwagon when we restarted Oathbound for a couple good reasons, number one because it was the closest thing to the old d20 system Oathbound was originally written for. Number two because we had assumed that there was a whole bunch of people out there that were rabid about pathfinder and would buy anything with the Pathfinder logo on it. Well, that didn't turn out to be true really. Oathbound fans bought the books, but I don't know that anyone else did, so Oathbound ended up being a big money-loser for us. Not that I'm blaming Pathfinder, but my though is, well, if I'm not going to make money making these books, we then I might as well make them my way, which is in my own game system that I prefer.
And then reason number three is that it's really kind of frustrating to put some other company's logo on our books. That means that it's very hard for us to control what we are doing. The rules can change out from under us and then we'd have to go back in and rework something, or publish a brand new book and have it be out of date. There's also the fact that if the other company decided they don't like what we've written, they can make us destroy the books (not that they have, but they could). And then there's just that we have to adhere to rules we don't like. I'd much rather just have my fate in my own hands.
And finally, we'd been working with these rules for so long and they've worked so marvelously for us that at some point it seemed crazy not to share them with you all. So here we are. If you have enjoyed our other products, I suspect you'll find this one quite satisfying as well. It's been kind of our baby for quite a while now, and it's nice to not have to pretend it doesn't exist. I hope you enjoy... and feel free to add to the system, it is open-source for a reason.
--
President, Epidemic Books
|
|
0
• permalink
|
10/30/2013 6:54:21 AM
ShadowcatX
Posts: 53
|
This is probably going to be hard for you to read, but I want to assure you it isn't any easier for me to write. I'm going to try and be as friendly as I can, but some things need to be said. I'm going to start with Oathbound (but I will eventually get to Osiris) which is the focal point of my post.
So on Oathbound, I've been a big fan of it since day 1. Heck, I'm one of few people that bothered to hunt your personal forums down here and post. And I hate, HATE, that it has lost you all money. But I have to ask, have you all ever actually looked into why it lost you all money? Have you even thought about it for a second? Have you checked the reviews for it? There are 2 of them over at Paizo, one from yours truly (the first) and another one from the best and most prolific reviewer of 3pp material, Endzeitgeist himself. They are very, very similar, so let me sum them up for you if you haven't read them:
"Oathbound Seven has some of the best fluff and setting information ever, but the artwork is, at best, hit or miss, and the crunch is nightmarishly bad."
Of course there's more to them both than that, but that is the gist of both of them. I can't help but think of your comment about how crunch is the easiest thing for you to write and now your comment about how you thought Pathfinder fans would just buy anything with a Pathfinder logo on it. Perhaps you should have put a little more effort into your crunch, eh? Not that it is too late, I don't know Epidemic's finances, but other books have been reworked significantly and received upgraded reviews, you could even do a relaunch of the books. I would recommend getting someone who knows Pathfinder better to write the crunch though, until recently my suggestion would have been Owen, but he got snagged up just a couple weeks ago, so it'd have to be someone else, but there are plenty of freelancers who could do it.
But that won't happen, you've moved on to Osiris, a crunch product you made from the ground up, which just blows my mind. I mean seriously, the market has a ton of various systems, systems put out by big name publishing companies and companies who have big name flag ship products that drive their sales. What does Osiris have to draw people to it? The fact that it is free? Sorry, Pathfinder's free as well, and already has a huge customer base. That it is open even more than Pathfinder? Sorry, the only people who would care about that are 3pp, and they'd rather have a more closed system that is popular vs. a more open one that is unheard of, after all, they want to sell book and they can't sell books when no one plays their system.
But more over, why should they, or any one, want a mechanical system from the people who did so poorly designing mechanical systems for Pathfinder? You all have turned away from the part you were actually good at (and you were really, really good at fluff) and totally embraced the area where you suck. I'm sorry, but even as one of your biggest fans, I can't support that move. And maybe I should have said this earlier. Actually, I'm sure I should have said this earlier.
So why am I posting this now? Because I want epidemic books to come back, and because I think you could. But it is going to take a lot, make no mistake. Come over to Paizo's forums, read some of the threads with suggestions on how to find artwork and find you a good freelancer that knows the Pathfinder ruleset. With that done, I think you could build up interest in a kickstarter and not risk any more actual money on the project. I hope you'll at least consider this.
|
|
0
• permalink
|
11/2/2013 1:17:42 AM
Greg Dent
Administrator
Posts: 195
|
Interesting. I appreciate the honesty.
I'm can't say I agree with you, but at least you cared enough to put this out there. First off, the reviews you mention are not ones I'd seen. I have never heard anyone say they didn't like the "crunch" aspects of Oathbound before. Nightmarishly bad? Sounds like hyperbole. I was pretty happy with the Oathbound Pathfinder mechanics. So no, I hadn't considered that we were focusing on what we were worst at, since I wasn't aware that was perceived as a weakness. Most of the reviews and comments I read were positive.
As for the terms "Crunch" and "Fluff", I rather despise them, and they imply that the writing is useless and throwaway, and that the mechanics are all that matter. Which is why people might think that it would be easy for us to write a product without the game mechanics, which really is quite wrong. It's like saying, "Why don't you just write a few novels, it should be easy." My education has actually bee in math, not writing, so to be honest, I've always considered the mechanics my strong suit. Of course, people can disagree with just about anything, it's all a matter of taste. The art is not for everyone either, but I rally only have one artist, and it's not economically feasible for me to hire more without a budget.
As for Osiris? As I've said before, this has basically beome a hobby business, and we don't play Pathfinder. It is not enjoyable to write for a system I don't like, so why do this at all if we aren't enjoying it? Sure, Pathfinder is better than whatever passes for D&D at this point, but it's kind of embarrassing how much a ripoff it is of 3rd edition. And then in order to write for their system I have to play by their rules and put their logo on my book, and then they can choose to ask me to destroy all my inventory if they decide they don't like what I've written? No thank you; not for a company that basically stole their core product to begin with. I can make my own ripoff of d&d and not have to be beholden to anyone.
Osiris may not be perfect, but it plays quite well (really well, actually), and I feel like I have control over my own destiny. Also, right now we have a new game system. In a year or two ,we will be done with all the mechanics and back to writing the stuff people like. If the mechanics stink, then you probably don't need to care if it's not in your system of choice.
As for Oathbound, it's not dead. If there is a market for it, we would consider it. Right now, there doesn't appear to be one, so we are going to just write what excites us. We do have some Oathbound miniatures coming out next year that are pretty bad ass. And I would not be opposed to someone else writing the next Oathbound book under a license or something if they are really interested in doing so. Also, it may be worth noting that we did hire Sig Trent to edit and bless all the pathfinder mechanics in the bestiary, and he didn't find too much to change. Though maybe that books isn't one of the ones people had issues with.
Anyway, thanks for the comments. There will be more fluff coming from us in the future. Hopefully we can impress you with some of it.
--
President, Epidemic Books
|
|
0
• permalink
|